file Knee deep in Snake Oil, or not?

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WayneWilmeth Posted 3 years 8 months ago
#18328
I can't walk across the pasture without stepping in shit!
But I really did not mean to start a nasty discussion, well not exactly. Discussion but not nasty.
These topics have been debated in audio ad nauseum, and to no resolution.
But my point was/is, it may all seem to be snake oil and mirrors until it happens to you. Until you hear it with your own ears.
God bless,
Wayne
God bless the child that's got his own.
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T Cobe Posted 3 years 8 months ago
#18330
Wayne,

I'm not sure it's gotten nasty here. I don't see any name calling, unless Moderator Dude removed a post... there's nothing wrong with sharing opinions as long as people respect each other's differences.

I think we are on the same page, Wayne. I think the mind is a powerful instrument. We can convince ourselves that we don't hear a difference if we don't want to, and vice verse when doing listening comparisons. I would encourage anyone going into this to keep an open mind.

When I started down the path of audio tweaks, I didn't think there would be differences and I certainly didn't want to spend as much as I did on cables, but I could hear a difference. The difference between my Nordost XLR connectors and the Mogami Gold cables I was using is significant, for example, and I'm confident that I could pick out which is which in a blind test consistently. Some upgrades are not as obvious.

Everyone needs to decide for themselves if these tweaks are an improvement and if the improvement is worth the expense. In the end, what matters most is that we all enjoy our own systems, respect each others opinions, and stay away from the Haterade. While I find the notion of a $100,000 speaker cable a bit absurd, I'm not going to tell the guy that bought them he's an idiot. Seems like a bit of a case of the have and have nots, to a certain degree. Dr. Seuss captured that here:



Cheers,

T Cobe
Speakers: Triton One L/R, SCXL, Aon 3 Surr/Back, HTR-7000 Height
Pre/Pro/AVR: Anthem AVM 60, Emotiva XSP-1
Amps: Emotiva XPA-5(2), Emotiva XPA-1L (2)
Sources: Oppo BDP-103D, Emotiva ERC-3, PS4, Pioneer PLX-1000 w/Ortofon 2M Bronze
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The Jay Posted 3 years 8 months ago
#18333
I've got another one for you....

Back around 1990, I was a teenager and my mom's boyfriend was into audio...I remember him dropping like a grand on a hifi VHS, trying to tape audio to VHS cause someone told him it sounded better, moving things an inch this way or that to see if it would make a difference in sound, etc. I'll confess I thought it strange at the time, but here I am obsessed about sound in the car and now at home..

Anyhow, one of the things I remember him bringing home was this disc. It looked almost like it was made out of fridge magnet material, the exact dimensions of a CD. You put it on top of the CD before putting it in the player, and it was supposed to make it sound better.

I remember trying it over and over and then eventually concluding that it made it sound ever so slightly 'warmer', but then doubting that and wondering if it was all in my head....but I never met anyone else that ever heard/saw/used such a thing.
Upstairs: SuperCinema 3 (SVS SB-2000 though), Denon AVR E-400
Downstairs: Triton 2+, SCXXL, MPX's on the sides, HTR's up top, rears ?? Marantz SR7010, PB-2000
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WayneWilmeth Posted 3 years 8 months ago
#18339
Yes, the Jay, heard of that one too. Did not catch on very well, if memory serves.
Yes, Bro T. I agree with all you said.
The mind is a terrible thing to waste, ha ha.
The weirdest one (even worse than bricks and bags of sand or something on top of your amps, or green markers of the edges of CDs) to me was the bell, I posted a pic, and several admired its effect, even Sam Tellig from Stereophile, IF I remember correctly, as well as the guy from PS Audio here:
www.psaudio.com/pauls-posts/the-strangest-tweak-ever/

OR speaker cable risers. I made my own and gave that one a try, NOTHING I could hear.
Funny.
God Bless,
Wayne
God bless the child that's got his own.
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rjohn79395 Posted 3 years 8 months ago
Last edit: 3 years 8 months ago by rjohn79395. info_outline
#18352
Do I dare re-open this can of worms, or "Stepping in "Sh**", as Wayne calls it?

Well, I'm going to. I had posted about the Ayres Acoustics "Irrational But Efficacious" system enhancement disc and how one casual use with no before/after listening testing hadn't created for me anything I noticed as standing out.

I felt some guilty about that without better testing, but wanted to see if anyone else had tried it. Haven't gotten a response, but have been playing around with it since. There are 7 tracks on it. Track 1 is a 1 minute glide from 5 HZ to 20kHZ for a quicker pass through. Track 7 is a 5 minute glide up of the same frequencies and the recommended option. Other tracks are for other purposes: two are brown noise for speaker and cable break-in, one in phase and other out of phase for anyone wishing to direct the speaker at each other and minimize SL's. I've only played tracks 1 and 7. I can FFEL the sub bass before I hear anything on the way up, and at lower SL's I lose hearing the higher tones before the end... maybe a good longer term test of hearing range :)

IMPRESSIONS so far: at the very least, playing either of these tracks at the minimum speeds up/reinforces getting to max warmth and mellowness, and MAYBE even enhances that. I played track 7 after re listening to a number on a Mumford and Sons Blu-ray after a cold start had left me not as impressed with that number as the first listening. Playing the 5 minute system enhancement track completely fixed that. Bass blossomed (again?), drumsticks playing on drum rims got cleaner, more dynamic (again???). Just a quicker warm-up than the usual 30 minutes? Adding a little extra? I can't tell. I usually repeat test listening sessions.... play a piece, make the change, play it again, note differences, change back, repeat the process, until I'm pretty happy with what I've detected (or not): did drum brushes get cleaner, bass better/worse, trumpets less harsh, etc. Can't do that with this disc, can't "undo" whatever subtle changes it made and retest.

In Jim Smith's book, "Get Better Sound", at different points he has mentioned two things he always does with a set-up for a trade show: WARM UP the system well in advance, and run the System Enhancement System disc every morning before people show up to listen. My new warm up routine is to play track 7 on the disc as part of system warm-up - 5 minutes. I seem to "come out of the shute" with warm, mellow sound. Cleaner, warmer than before, or just faster? I'm having a harder time with that, since I can't retest.

I'm impressed enough with what the disc does to make it a part of system warm-up every day... 5 minutes run time and at $24ish cost on Amazon is a pretty easy and inexpensive way to try something that gets my system up to speed fast, and MAY take it a step further.. As always, YMMV.

I'm a happy camper, even if I can't define just what that little disc is doing.

Rick
5.4.4 HT speakers: T Ref fronts/LFE 1, SuperCenter Ref, T1 surrounds/LFE 2, HTR 7000 top fronts, Invisa 525 top rears
Zone 2 speakers; 2 Invisa 525's
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WayneWilmeth Posted 3 years 8 months ago
Last edit: 3 years 8 months ago by WayneWilmeth. Reason: more info_outline
#18355
Interesting report Bro Rick!!!
Nurse can you bring that jacket here that wraps around the back?????
No, kidding. Obviously you can hear something and in terms of warming up you system makes some sense. With my tubes, on the other hand, I think that thermally they can only warm up with time, and that cannot be hurried up by a disc. I think.
Course it's getting close to 100 of your small degrees here today, outside. So how long can it take to get warm?????
Dog, I am almost ready to listen and I haven't even turned my system on yet!!!!
Not really, and it is much cooler inside my man cave than outside.
Gotta love fans though.
Speaking of, I have a DC fan (ceiling) in my home theater that I am really impressed with. It is not totally quiet, as it does go round n round moving air which can be heard, but the motor is totally quiet and supposed to run on nearly no electr. (It has a small built in spot light that is not shown on this pic)
Here is a pic, got this puppy in the Big Mango.
God Bless,
Wayne
God bless the child that's got his own.
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