file Musings About Speaker Placement and Adding Bass to Triton Ones

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ArthurDaniels Posted 1 month 1 week ago
#28034
Hi Gang,

I am still alive, kicking, and still playing with my audio gear. A few days ago, I decided to move my Triton Ones to the corners along the long 24-foot wall in our upstairs "media room" in our new Raleigh digs. Along with relocating the Triton Ones, I also moved my Triton Sevens to a position inside the Ones and along the same wall. The Sevens are about 13 feet apart, whereas the Ones are about 23 feet apart. My PLP is in the center of these two dimensions but only about 8 feet from the Sevens and about 12 feet from the Ones. I also have my 1960s-vintage Altec-Lansing Boleros centered on the sides at each end of the room. So, I do not have the preferred equilateral triangle between the speakers and my PLP

The Ones are connected to my Cambridge 851A Azur Stereo Amplifier. The Sevens are connected to the Front speaker terminals of my Cambridge CXR120 7-channel AV Receiver, while the Boleros are connected to the Surround terminals of the CXR120. This arrangement allows me to independently adjust the volume levels of the Ones and the Seven/Bolero combination. I have plenty of stereo separation, while the Sevens provide "fill-in" sound to eliminate excessive separation which would result from the wide placement of the Ones.

Placing the Ones in the corners significantly enhanced the bass response at my PLP.. The bass is tight without being "boomy". The LFE level controls on the Ones are set to the "Noon" mid-level position and I am driving the Ones without any bass enhancement from the Cambridge 851.

For many recordings, the bass is sufficient. However, for other recordings with thin bass lines, I can augment the bass by virtue of secondary connections to the Ones' LFE terminals from a Sony 5.1 Receiver which is set up to provide an LFE sub-woofer signal to the LFE inputs of the Ones (the so-called "double bass" effect frowned upon by many audiophiles).

Now, I have a technical question for the Community. With my setup, I have the option of providing "Double Bass" in one of two ways. I can provide a derived LFE signal from the sub-out terminal of my Sony Receiver. Or, I can provide a variable line-level L/R full range signal from my Cambridge stereo amplifier via a separate Chase Technologies line-level controller. So, the question is: Which approach would be best handled by the bass amplifiers in the Ones? Would the Ones prefer a derived mono LFE signal from the 5.1 Receiver or a full-range Left and Right signal from the stereo amplifier, from which the Ones bass amplifier and filters would extract the low-frequency components of the full-range signal?

Comments from the Community and from our beloved Moderator would be much appreciated.

Happy Listening to All,

Art
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Moderator Posted 1 month 1 week ago
#28036
Hi Art,

Wow, as much as I wish I could just say do this or do that, you'll probably need to try it both ways.

As I recall, the Chase RLC's main preamp chip has a "built-in" loudness curve. That is, it boosts the bass and treble a bit at its lower volume settings and flattens out when it's set louder.
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Moderator Posted 1 month 1 week ago
#28037
For reference here's a datasheet for the TEA6320 chip used in the RLC1: pdf.datasheetcatalog.com/datasheet/philips/TEA6320_2.pdf

I recall the RLC1 had quite a following in its day.
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ArthurDaniels Posted 1 month 1 week ago
#28039
Hi Mr. Moderator,

Thanks for your reply and for the RLC Processor data sheet. A dear friend gave me the RLC-1 unit just a couple of years ago after her husband passed away. He was a long-time audiophile and she knew that I would appreciate having the Chase unit.

I will try both setups. My reason for asking about both approaches was to elicit comments about how the Triton One's internal crossovers and filters would handle a full-range line-level signal versus handling an LFE signal, as generated by a multi-channel AV Receiver. Also, I wondered about possible advantages related to providing a Left/Right line level signal (Left and Right to the respective Left and Right Ones' LFE inputs) versus providing a derived mono LFE signal to both Left and Right Triton One LFE inputs.

I listen to a wide variety of music, ranging from choral to full orchestra to chamber to jazz. I generally listen at volume levels considerably lower than what might be typically described as "room volume". Therefore, bass roll-off and variations in bass-level response are real concerns. I am pleased with having my Triton Ones in the corners because the enhanced bass response means that I do not have to provide augmented bass at lower volume levels as often as with my previous setup.

Best,

Art
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Moderator Posted 1 month 1 week ago
#28040

ArthurDaniels wrote: Hi Mr. Moderator,

I will try both setups. My reason for asking about both approaches was to elicit comments about how the Triton One's internal crossovers and filters would handle a full-range line-level signal versus handling an LFE signal, as generated by a multi-channel AV Receiver. Also, I wondered about possible advantages related to providing a Left/Right line level signal (Left and Right to the respective Left and Right Ones' LFE inputs) versus providing a derived mono LFE signal to both Left and Right Triton One LFE inputs.

I listen to a wide variety of music, ranging from choral to full orchestra to chamber to jazz. I generally listen at volume levels considerably lower than what might be typically described as "room volume". Therefore, bass roll-off and variations in bass-level response are real concerns. I am pleased with having my Triton Ones in the corners because the enhanced bass response means that I do not have to provide augmented bass at lower volume levels as often as with my previous setup.


Art,

The LFE input on the speakers is essentially unfiltered, relying on your processor to send it Low-pass/LFE info only. You could send full range L/R line level to the LFE inputs instead but without trying it, I'm not sure how that would sound. The powered Triton amps likely have a fairly high low-pass range, but doubtful if it's much over 300 Hz or so.

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rjohn79395 Posted 1 month 1 week ago
Last edit: 1 month 1 week ago by rjohn79395. info_outline
#28041
Hi, Art

Moderator Dude has provided great, detailed answers, so just a comment or two about your questions.

First, SO glad you're feeling back to par, and experimenting again! That's the Art we know.

Re bass rolloff, that's a human ear perception fact, as opposed to a speaker capability issue. Tritons and speakers in general do play all frequencies at similar matched levels at most any SL within their capabilities. It's our ears that lose ability to discern upper and lower frequencies at lower SL's, unfortunately more so with age. So, perceived bass rolloff is somewhat of an individual thing.

You are at the forefront of experimenting with speaker placement and "fill in" speakers, use of several receivers, varying bass sources and crossovers, to get what you want to hear at lower listening levels that can cause ear perception dropoffs in bass (and treble) .

My only addition to the conversation is that letting the crossovers in the Tritons receive full range signals and doing their thing to utilize the array of drivers and radiators they're designed to maximise sure seems to be to be a preferred approach.

Happy listening, and experimenting!!! Glad you're back "in the swing"!

Rick
5.4.4 HT speakers: T Ref fronts/LFE 1, SuperCenter Ref, T1 surrounds/LFE 2, HTR 7000 top fronts, Invisa 525 top rears
Zone 2 speakers; 2 Invisa 525's
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Amps: AT525NC 5 channel, Parasound 275 v.2 stereo
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